Discussions about sports and politics are again on the rise. Sportscaster Bob Costas has long been one of the sports media figures most willing to discuss off-the-field contexts to games, including political dimensions, and he did that again in the latest episode of NBC’s Meet The Press, which will air at 11 a.m. ET Sunday.

Awful Announcing received an advance transcript of Costas’ conversation with Meet The Press host Kristen Welker. Their discussion covered a wide range of interesting subjects, including Costas’ thoughts on his career (he feels at this point “whatever I do should be in an emeritus role”) and some of his most memorable calls, his sports history with his father (who passed away when the younger Costas was 18; they had a complicated relationship around sports partly due to the elder Costas’ gambling habits), and the state of sports and gambling today.

However, maybe the most notable conversation came near the end of the segment. Welker noted that this is Costas’ 13th Meet The Press appearance, and then asked for his thoughts on sports as a unifier, saying “And it comes at a time when our country is very divided. I don’t have to tell you that. Sports is unifying. People rally around their team, the games that they love. What can sports teach us and teach this country about unifying?”

Costas responded to that with a discussion of how sports can unify, but also can “become tribal,” especially in light of the tone in many sports conversations today.

“Well, the best of sports, especially team sports, is the idea that people from diverse backgrounds come together in the service of a common cause, that cause being to do as well as you possibly can as a team,” he said. “And you look at the arena and you look at the stadium and you see people with differing political viewpoints and from differing demographics but they’re all there rooting for their team. And in that moment that’s unifying.

“On the other hand, some of the tone now that surrounds sports, as we talked about before, is angry and accusatory. And it becomes tribal sometimes in a way that isn’t really all that healthy in my mind.”

Welker followed that up by saying “Politics is a part of sports. Sports is a part of politics. Does it concern you that we are seeing, in some instances, politics infused in sports?” And Costas responded that that infusion is nothing new.

“I think that politics inevitably has intersected with sports. Anyone who says that politics has no place in sports has to be abysmally unaware of the history here. Because until fairly recently in our nation’s history sports and some aspects of entertainment have been the only avenues that were broadly – and even then there was a fight, Jackie Robinson didn’t come until 1947– that were broadly accessible to people of color or where someone like Billie Jean King could make a larger statement about women’s rights, not just within sports.

“And to turn your back on that is to wear a blindfold. So when people say, “Stick to sports,” I think what they actually mean most often is, “Stick to sports unless you’re saying something that I want to hear and I agree with. But if you’re saying something I disagree with that comes from a different perspective, well, then you should just shut up and say, ‘There’s a ground ball to shortstop.’ I never bent to that.”

Costas indeed did not. His on-air work over the years has often included thoughts on sports’ connections beyond the field, especially in a host or essayist role on broadcasts including the Olympics and Sunday Night Football. And, as he noted to Welker elsewhere in this conversation, he’s continued to take stances even in more recent years, including refusing to read gambling promos during the baseball games he was calling for MLB Network and TNT Sports. He’s also not been shy about sharing his personal views on political figures, including criticizing U.S. president Donald Trump and former president Joe Biden.

But this particular discussion from Costas is perhaps especially notable and impactful at this moment in time, including around the rising conversations about sports and politics. Costas is quite right to note that the “stick to sports” conversations are generally about athletes or commentators with views opposed to the critic, and that those who share the views of that critic often don’t get blasted by them. (Also, some of those espousing “stick to sports” often do anything but themselves.)

Even more significantly, Costas is correct that there have been a ton of crossovers between sports and politics in the past. And he’s seen plenty of those firsthand in his decades of high-profile work. Costas’ (often firsthand) knowledge of sports history is something he certainly bring to those emeritus commentator roles he discussed with Welker earlier in this conversation, and, as we’ve seen before, a lot of comments have more of an impact when it’s him making them. There’s some value to having him use his sports history knowledge and perspective in high-profile spots, including this Meet The Press interview.